Subtitle and technical support problems

[bereid]

I recently attempted to use an evaluation copy of Blu-ray Converter Ultimate 2.1.1.34 on a Windows 7 x64 system, hoping to overcome reliability issues I have been experiencing with a similar product from a different vendor.

My first use of the product was to convert a .ISO image file of the movie Troy using H264 compression and an MKV wrapper. The .ISO was ripped from the original media using a utility that has consistently performed flawlessly, so I am very confident that there is nothing peculiar about the .ISO file. In fact, when I stream the unconverted .ISO file to my player, a recent-generation WDTV Live, it plays perfectly, and subtitles can be selected and played with no trouble..

I configured the tool to generate [non-embedded] subtitles, something which I routinely do, because I like the option to enable/disable them while viewing.

When I played the resulting .MKV file, everything ALMOST worked. With each scene calling for a subtitle change, some subtitles flashed momentarily on the screen, and disappeared so quickly that they could not be read; some subtitles were entirely missing from the corresponding dialog. In any case, the subtitles did not perform well enough to be of any use.

I looked for a similar problem and solution on this forum, but failing to find any similar topic, I submitted a support request last week, using the website link labeled "Technical Support
In case you are experiencing problems with our software (error, crash, etc) and you need a direct contact with VSO team member". As yet, I have received no reply, not even a confirmation that my request was received.

My first hope is that someone can advise me how to resolve the subtitle problem. My second hope is that if I decide to invest in a license for this software, the technical support will not be as completely unavailable as it has been thus far.

Thanks in advance for any help, both with the subtitle problem, and in setting realistic expectations for support from this software vendor.

[bereid]

Additional information: When I use the VLC application on my Mac to play the .MKV file produced by the VSO converter, the subtitles seem to work properly. So there appears to be an incompatibility between the .MKV file and my player, a WDTV Live. However, for all .MKV files I have previously produced by using DVDFab to process the .ISO image (either Blu-Ray or DVD), and then using mkvmerge to yield the final .MKV, playback is correct regardless whether I use VLC (Mac or PC) or the WDTV Live. So I know it is possible to produce .MKV files that are compatible with both playback methods, but VSO Blu-ray Converter Ultimate is not producing such robust files (at least not with the settings I have tried).

Any advice will be much appreciated; I have recently uploaded a log file of the problematic conversion.

[JJ]

One thing to remember; MKV is container, not fileformat.
You need to ensure that all files inside MKV are in correct format for your player.

[Claire]

1st of all, I am sorry to hear you have not heard back from our technical support. Did you write them with the same email you used to join the forum? If so I will search to see if at least your request for help was received. We are generally very good at getting back in less than 24 hours (Mon- Friday).

The information you have provided to trouble shoot is very good. Thanks.
I will see with some developer if he has an idea on where the problem could be coming from.

[bereid]

Claire,

Thank you for your reply. I cannot fully recall the details of filling out the original technical support request, but I believe some of the keywords that I probably included in the description are: subtitle & flashing or flickering.

I'm glad to hear the information I provided looks helpful, and I hope a solution can be found.

My brief experience with Blu-ray Converter Ultimate has been mostly positive; I like the user interface, and the controls and options seem to cover all the bases, and be easy to use. I purchased a lifetime license for the DVDFab Blu-ray ripper and DVD ripper, and I have been using those tools for some time. But DVDFab has proven to be very unreliable; each new release of the software introduces as many new bugs as those that were fixed. Most recently, it simply freezes as soon as it begins processing. So I am very hopeful that a solution to this subtitle problem can be found, and the VSO app can serve as a replacement for DVDFab.

I use WDTV Live players as my primary means for viewing all of my media files, only occasionally viewing them on a Mac or PC with VLC. So, it is important that the files produced must be compatible with WDTV Live, and inclusion of subtitles that can be enabled/disabled when viewing is an essential aspect for me.

Thank you again for investigating this.

[Claire]

What JJ has said above is pertinent.

Can you provide the information of an MKV of a file that plays on your player (for example made with another converter) - you can use MediaInfo.
Or read the manual and post us exactly what specs are supported by your player.

I've tracked down your request for technical help, which as transferred to a developer (as 1st line of support did not have the knowledge to reply). I am sorry you were not informed your request was received and transferred.

Nonetheless we are investigating your specific case.

[bereid]

I have finished preparing MediaInfo for two .mkv files produced from the same Blu-Ray .iso image file. One was produced using DVDFab & mkvmerge, the other was produced using my evaluation copy of VSO Blu-Ray Converter Ultimate.

The file produced via the VSO application exhibits the same flickering subtitle behavior as I described earlier for the movie Troy. The file produced via DVDFab & mkvmerge plays without any subtitle problems.

I am attaching text documents produced by MediaInfo for both .mkv files. I'm also attaching the VSO log file created during the conversion of the problematic .mkv file, and a document showing the Multimedia formats supported by my player (those specifications can also be accessed on this Western Digital website: http://www.wdc.com/global/products/spec ... language=1).

Thank you for your continued help to resolve this problem.

[bereid]

Dear VSO Support,

Here is some additional information that I hope may be helpful in diagnosing my subtitle problem.

I have used mkvtoolnix to extract .idx and .sub files from the .mkv files produced by DVDFab/mkvmerge
(the working .mkv file), and by VSO Blu-Ray Converter Ultimate (the problematic .mkv file).

When I extracted these tracks from the .mkv files, I asked the tool to extract all subtitle tracks
in both cases. The extraction tool assigned its own track numbers to the filenames as it performed
its task. I don't completely understand why the tracks extracted from the DVDFab version have
numbers 2 and 3, while those extracted from the VSO version have numbers 3 and 4; but I believe
that DVDFab tracks 2/3 correspond to VSO tracks 3/4.

I am not familiar with the structure of these .idx and .sub files, so I cannot claim to interpret
their contents. But the listing below shows significant size differences between the two sets of
files, and that would seem to be an important clue.

I attempted to compare the .idx files, but was unable to draw any meaningful conclusions. If it
would be helpful for me to send the first N lines from each file for your analysis, please let
me know, and I will be happy to do so.

-rw-r--r-- 1 reid staff 41730 Mar 14 17:36 AugustRush_Track02.idx
-rw-r--r-- 1 reid staff 3799 Mar 14 17:40 AugustRush-VSO-Eval_Track03.idx

-rw-r--r-- 1 reid staff 57165 Mar 14 17:36 AugustRush_Track03.idx
-rw-r--r-- 1 reid staff 5104 Mar 14 17:40 AugustRush-VSO-Eval_Track04.idx

-rw-r--r-- 1 reid staff 5857280 Mar 14 17:36 AugustRush_Track02.sub
-rw-r--r-- 1 reid staff 440320 Mar 14 17:40 AugustRush-VSO-Eval_Track03.sub

-rw-r--r-- 1 reid staff 8534016 Mar 14 17:36 AugustRush_Track03.sub
-rw-r--r-- 1 reid staff 675840 Mar 14 17:40 AugustRush-VSO-Eval_Track04.sub

Thank you again for your help with this problem.

[Claire]

Hello,

Thanks for this info, the mediainfo you posted of supposedly DVDFab is actually of our output with VSO Blu-ray Converter.

Can you post the mediainfo of the file created by DVDFab?

[bereid]

Hello,

I apologize for my error. I have processed the working (DVDFab) movie file with MediaInfo, and have attached the resulting text. I noticed that the file (excerpt below) shows a discrepancy that might be misleading. The 'Complete name' attribute correctly identifies the movie file as AugustRush.mkv. The 'Movie name' attribute shows a name that DVDFab must have generated, because I have never entered a title of that form; it must be residue from a previous operation, though I have not used the tool to process the 'Fantastic Four' movie for a very long time, and there have been many others in the time between that movie and 'August Rush'. I will investigate why DVDFab is retaining prior attributes, but I encourage your investigative team to disregard the 'Movie name' attribute, and I assure you that the information pertains to the move 'August Rush', and NOT 'Fantastic Four'.

Also, I think my earlier comment about the differing sizes of the .idx/.sub files overlooked the fact that the VSO evaluation tool produced only a 10-minute sample, whereas the other file is the full-length movie, so my size observations may not be meaningful.

I look forward to hearing from you again soon.

Sincerely,
Bruce

---- Begin MediaInfo excerpt ----
Unique ID : 173088682495696510508145416914366698477 (0x8237AAEC1CF2C230B23013BC425913ED)
Complete name : /Volumes/Public/Shared Videos/movies/AugustRush.mkv
Format : Matroska
File size : 4.84 GiB
Duration : 1h 53mn
Overall bit rate : 6 105 Kbps
Movie name : 43906620_FANTASTIC_FOUR.Title0.BlurayRip
---- End MediaInfo excerpt ----

[Claire]

Hi Bruce,

I think later today we will post a version that I hope will correct your problem.

[bereid]

Thank you, Claire. That is encouraging news!

Shall I check the forum or the download website periodically to best know when the update is available to try?

[Claire]

Here is the new beta that we would like you to try with
http://forums.vso-software.fr/new-blu-r ... 17098.html

[bereid]

Hello Claire,

I used the new beta version to process two different blu-ray .iso files, one for the movie Troy, and one for the movie August Rush. The results are the same as before, both .mkv files play on my WDTV Live with flickering subtitles that are unreadable. As I mentioned before, both of these .iso files have been processed with DVDFab to produce .mkv files with subtitles that display properly.

I have attached the log files for both conversion attempts.

Please let me know what information I might provide next to help analyze and hopefully solve this problem.

Thank you

[cedric]

Hello bereid,

Can you try to encode same Blu-ray ISO file (Troy) using a custom profile?
In encoder profile selector component, click on "Custom profiles" then "Click here to add a custom profile".
Give the profile name you want and select "mkv" as container.
For video track codec, select H264.

For video track resolution, select "same as source", same for framerate field.
For audio track select AC3 for codec , channels : 6, Sample rate : 48KHz, bitrate : 224Kbps
For subtitle track, select "Merge subtitle in video" (there is the point I want to check)

Encode your Troy ISO file using this profile and let me know.
- If the subtitle displays correctly, the problem is in vobsub subtitle muxing in Full HD (1080p) profile you tested before.
- If same problem appear, the problem is in PGS subtitle timestamp decoding...

I'm waiting for your feedback...

Thank you for your help!

[bereid]

Hello Cedric,

I performed your instructions with good success. The subtitles when embedded in the video stream appear to play properly. Do you expect that this information will help to resolve the problem when they are not embedded?

I have attached the log file produced from this conversion with the custom profile.

Thank you,
Bruce

[cedric]

Hello Bruce,

Thank you for your test.
Can you tell me if the subtitle tracks in this movie are displayed using fadein/fadeout?

Regards,

[bereid]

Hi Cedric,

I just checked, and the subtitles appear and disappear abruptly, so I believe the answer to your question is no.

Thank you for your continued help. I'm very hopeful that Blu-Ray Converter Ultimate will serve as my complete replacement of DVDFab, which in my experience, has proven to be highly unreliable, with each software update introducing as many new bugs as those solved.

I appreciate that your VSO tool delegates the business of handling copy protection to others, so you can focus more attention on the conversion/processing aspects. The AnyDVD HD tool has proven consistently effective at producing .iso images from my original DVD & Blu-Ray discs, so I think it is very reasonable and practical for VSO to produce a tool that does not duplicate that effort.

Best regards,
Bruce

[bereid]

What's next? Is this issue still being worked, or has it been dismissed? I would still like to be able to purchase a license for this product, but...

[cedric]

We are doing some major changes in our encoder engine, a new version will be published on next week...
I tried to reproduce your problem here with 6 different movies but subtitles are well displayed.
Will retry when new engine will be stable.

Regards,