VSO Software Forum

Hi all,

Even if this discussion is a bit stressed, it's still very interesting to users of the forum to read different thought...

Little reminder:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=154533

So, the only one answer I can give you is that we can't produce a 1080p 25Fps video because it's not a part of Blu-ray specifications.
We don't want to create interlaced output (not a technical problem, just a choice...)

Any PAL HD stream I convert turns out converted to 23.976fps resulting in jerky playback. Strangely it is supported on the ConvertXtoDVD"

Why this is strange? Original DVD Video PAL framerate is 25Fps (29,97Fps for NTSC) with 720x576 resolution... (when Original Blu-ray framerates are 23,97 or 24 Fps for progressive output)

The jerky problem when converting PAL (25Fps) to Blu-ray (24Fps) is a known problem and we need to find a solution.
The first one (already implemented for the next versions) is to merge the extra frame with the next one intead of dropping it.
The second one is to change the playing rate to not loose any frame (but this way need to do a audio resample).

The last one seems to be the better solution and is the most used way to do the 25 to 24 Fps, but need time to implement...

Regards,

Hello woody8,

I worked (hard) on your problem/feature request and you should be able to convert PAL content to Blu-ray and keeping smooth playback!

I firstly tried by using some merge functions in place of dropping frames (the old way), but the result was not good enough.
The video was less jerky, but the dropped frame place (on each second) was too notifiable...

So, I worked on the best solution: the use of a time rescale for audio tracks...
That mean the audio tracks are resampled to match the video framerate.
By this way, all video frames are encoded and the output video is as smooth as input.

Please, install the last beta version (1.0.0.26) then let me know about your results (video smoothness, audio/video sync)

I'm waiting for your feedback...

Thank you for your help, and thank you to JJ for his great help in forum and others!

Regards,

PS: This feature request was tagged as low priority, but your post pushed it on top of my list. It's a great improvment for users converting DVD to Blu-ray/AVCHD...

Many thanks, I'll give it a try over the weekend and get back to you when I can. It's my 50th this weekend so I may be "recovering"

The only problem is as our HDTV broadcasts are 25fps interlaced, this software still won't help. Slowing down native broadcasts such as VT will introduce speed errors, whereas slowing down film content is ideal (removing the PAL speedup on film), I do that currently with the free MultiAVCHD and that works great

cedric wrote:.....and thank you to JJ for his great help in forum and others!

Oh, yeah.....he's been a big help! lol

Makes me wonder how he copes with DVD being interlaced!

Thanks again

woody8 wrote: Makes me wonder how he copes with DVD being interlaced!

Very simple; I use new technology and have abandoned anything lower than FullHD simply because I hate interlace. I hated it with CRT TVs, most CRT TVs gave me head ache. Using progressive displays is the way it is going, despite some that are still trying to drag everything behind with interlacing!
I have worked as cameraman for news footages, editing those footages and fighting even there with interlace artifacts. In those times there was no DVD, no CD - Betamax was coming as standard.

JJ wrote:

woody8 wrote: Makes me wonder how he copes with DVD being interlaced!

Very simple; I use new technology and have abandoned anything lower than FullHD simply because I hate interlace. I hated it with CRT TVs, most CRT TVs gave me head ache. Using progressive displays is the way it is going, despite some that are still trying to drag everything behind with interlacing!
I have worked as cameraman for news footages, editing those footages and fighting even there with interlace artifacts. In those times there was no DVD, no CD - Betamax was coming as standard.

The gift that keeps on giving.....

Actually, do you mean Betamax or Betacam since you're talking News camerawork? Betamax was a domestic format

Actually, do you mean Betamax or Betacam since you're talking News camerawork? Betamax was a domestic format

If I'm talking about domestic formats like DVD, CD - or course Betamax in that context. Then VHS and Video2000.
Cam that I mostly used was Philips LDK 6.

JJ wrote:

Actually, do you mean Betamax or Betacam since you're talking News camerawork? Betamax was a domestic format

If I'm talking about domestic formats like DVD, CD - or course Betamax in that context. Then VHS and Video2000.
Cam that I mostly used was Philips LDK 6.

Those tube camera days were fun, weren't they? Don't shoot a light!

The station I first started at used the big studio Philips LDK's, the 5 & 25 I think

Hello woody8,

I finally added an option in ConvertXtoHD to allow not compliant framerate in Blu-ray/AVCHD outputs...
If this option is enabled, the encoder will use the closest allowed framerate (23.97, 24, 25 or 29.97) regarding source file.
If not enabled, the encoder will use the closest official framerate (23.97 or 24).

I done a lot of test mixing 1080p/720p with 25p/30p framerate and all our test Blu-ray home players was able to play the movies without problem... and smoothly
So, I think the user need to test this option with his home player and if it works... he can use it without problem.
Unlike DVD home players, it seems that Blu-ray home players are able to play movies not totally compliant with official Blu-ray specifications.

This option is implemented in last ConvertXtoHD beta version, so I'm waiting for your feedback!
Happy birthday to you! this is my gift .

Have a good week-end...

Regards,

That's fantastic, many thanks, much appreciated. Am in recovery mode at the moment, will get back to you soon

Hi
Seems Woody8 has not replied to the modified 24/25 frames version of CXTHD, we are talking again here about, broadcast tv which is 1980x1080 i 25/30 frames
converting to Blu Ray using this software.
I have tried it, with 25 frame material, when rendering it starts off calling up 1080P 25 f then jumps to 30/31frames, anyway I burnt a Blu Ray from this rendering
16 mins worth, which is one of the TRP files my satellite receiver saves HD recordings as on HDD.
The Blu Ray plays back fine on Playstaion 3 and Panasonic Blu Ray player, the Mbps is upto 38, depending on picture content.

I tried another "Cleaned file" file with all the .TRP files joined, using TS Doctor, this started calling up from 25 frames jumped to 76 frames and remained there.
I did not continue with that.

I looked at the DVD image file on TS Doctor of the 31 frame burn to Blu Ray, it reported M2TS H264 Video 25 frames Progresive, so is this just a bug in the rendering display?

Hello menbed,

when rendering it starts off calling up 1080P 25 f then jumps to 30/31frames
so is this just a bug in the rendering display?

I think you're mixing the encoding rate (number of encoded pictures by second while converting) and output file frame rate?

The framerate displayed while converting is only an information about the encoding speed.

Regards,

Hi Cedric
Thanks for your reply.

Yes I was not aware that the displayed frame rate along side the 1080p codex, was only the conversion rate
during rendering, as it started off at 25 frames, which I was looking for in the output conversion, I wrongly
thought it was the output product frame rate.

menbed yont

Hi
I have with my second use with beta version 1.0.0.28, tried converting a large file "Joined" .TRP files which runs as the original 1920x1080 interlaced Meg2
4.2.0 colour space 16x9 aspect ratio to Blu Ray.(5.1 Dolby Digital audio)(4 DVB-S2 closed subtitle tracks different languages)
The file was joined by TS Doctor, plus checked for errors, came up with 2, the duration is 4 hours 3 mins of the material.
Used dual layer blank Blu Ray disc 50 Gb, called up DVB-9 as largest disc to burn to in convert to X

The result was very poor quality picture with only 3.4 to max 5 Mbps, on the finished product, normally get over 30 Mbps on Blu Ray, all other items were ok
eg Frame rate 25, plays back OK, on my two Blu Ray players.The frame conversion rate on rendering called up 79 frames(too high?).

1 other point the Hidden subtitles, when playing back the disc, said they were on the disc , but could not display them at all . Is that due to the fact that your software can only cope with "Text" based subtitles, sometimes called closed captions, not DVB embeded files?

menbed

called up DVB-9 as largest disc to burn to in convert to X

You can specify an output size from DVD-5 to BD-50 for Blu-ray/AVCHD output, I think you don't change the good setting?
Go in "General settings", "Blu-ray/AVCHD output"/"BD target size" and select BD-25 or BD-50.

Regards,

Hi Cedric
Thanks for info will give that a go

Any thoughts on Subtitles? the type we are trying to use are DVB-S2 closed subtitles, called up on screen of TV when present as DVB subtitles, not as the older teletext type, where in teletext mode on tv can select 777 for these to display, the ones we use are embbed with the codex, and all is set by the broadcaster,
size, font, etc. unlike Teletext simple versions, these are normally only on HD broadcasts.

menbed yont

Hi Cedric
yes agree its not an easy one, understand why your not answering this question.
Subtitles, the type your software copes with are when a sep subtitle file/track is used.
I think thats correct, with all the tests we have tried.

Thanks for the other answers you gave, they have cured my mistakes/problems

menbed

Hello menbed,

yes agree its not an easy one

It seems you're replying to your questions alone?

DVB-S2 subtitles support is in our task list, but will take time to implement...

Please create a new forum thread about this feature request to see the progression.

Thank you.

Please tell me this jerk has been fixed? I tried to burn my sons rugby match and every time I pan left or right the judder pops in. Can anyone tell me the name of a programme that can do a better job, or even a video software converter that can recode the video from 25fps to 23.97 so that I can simple burn it through convertxtohd with no jump.

Thank you.

Try with our latest version, as I don't know which one you are using.